Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to Markets


Mar 9 5:55 PM

 


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#6547 Mar 9 5:55 PM

Interesting video .. No Access to Markets in 87 and 89 ��... I dont understand why SPX would be any different than the stocks Sossnoff trades like TESLA , NETFLIX , IBM , FACEBOOK ��etc ... If it was 1987 Redux , he would have No Access to the Options on his stocks as well .. I wonder how long No Access lasted ... ��If anything SPX would be more liquid than his individual companies he trades .... Maybe thats why he is always Short ES but I still cant figure out how he doesn't lose money or get whipsawed in a Bull market doing that ....��



From: "Bobby Gaines bethandbob203@... [supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> To: "supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, March 9, 2016 5:36 PM Subject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] SPX Update

��

I asked Tom Sosnoff what hereally thought about Karen's style and whether he believed that shewould eventually blow out her account. ��Here is his response:

"ThanksBobby! I talked about this a bit on the show today. We've all come along way from 2008. I'm not sure if Karen could have survived 2008 backthen but today it would probably be a different story. She's anextraordinary talent and very, very rare. Most individual traders likeus need to stay small and mix things up. Karen is alive inspiration but you need to have your own trading style."

He also spoke about this on the March 8 edition of Talking with Tom and Tony.�� You don't have to listen to the entire segment.�� It is the very first caller who asks the question.�� I found this to be an interesting topic.

Timing Rolling Into Strength



��

�� �� �� �� �� ��

Timing Rolling Into StrengthGot a burning trade question and need an answer fast? Call in to 855-BE-TASTY at 10am CST Mon-Fri and have your question answered live! You'll also get ...



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#6550 Mar 9 6:32 PM

Tyler ,I was wondering if you did any research concerning Short Calls during such a situation as 1987 .... Let's say there was no access , did it apply to what would be, a far out of the money short Call , pursuant to a market crash ? If the spreads are ridiculously wide and ��illiquid , can that possibly be a unforeseen margin ��problem at 5 calls per $ 100,000 , even if they were intrinsically ��profitable ?��Thanks��Victor��



From: "Vic Ferrari vico213@... [supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> To: "supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, March 9, 2016 8:55 PM Subject: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] NO Access to Markets

��Interesting video .. No Access to Markets in 87 and 89 ��... I dont understand why SPX would be any different than the stocks Sossnoff trades like TESLA , NETFLIX , IBM , FACEBOOK ��etc ... If it was 1987 Redux , he would have No Access to the Options on his stocks as well .. I wonder how long No Access lasted ... ��If anything SPX would be more liquid than his individual companies he trades .... Maybe thats why he is always Short ES but I still cant figure out how he doesn't lose money or get whipsawed in a Bull market doing that ....��



From: "Bobby Gaines bethandbob203@... [supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> To: "supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, March 9, 2016 5:36 PM Subject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] SPX Update



��

I asked Tom Sosnoff what hereally thought about Karen's style and whether he believed that shewould eventually blow out her account. ��Here is his response:

"ThanksBobby! I talked about this a bit on the show today. We've all come along way from 2008. I'm not sure if Karen could have survived 2008 backthen but today it would probably be a different story. She's anextraordinary talent and very, very rare. Most individual traders likeus need to stay small and mix things up. Karen is alive inspiration but you need to have your own trading style."

He also spoke about this on the March 8 edition of Talking with Tom and Tony.�� You don't have to listen to the entire segment.�� It is the very first caller who asks the question.�� I found this to be an interesting topic.

Timing Rolling Into Strength



��

�� �� �� �� �� ��

Timing Rolling Into StrengthGot a burning trade question and need an answer fast? Call in to 855-BE-TASTY at 10am CST Mon-Fri and have your question answered live! You'll also get ...



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#6551 Mar 9 6:40 PM

Yes, definitely a problem. ��You will see spreads of something like $1 to $100 with it entirely illiquid.

Your broker can incorrectly calculate the margin expectation given the wide spread for something that is 20 percent out of the money.

It is one of the reasons I am now not with ib because Tos wouldn't have such awkward calculations.

-Tyler

---------------From: Vic Ferrari vico213@... [supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>Sent: Wednesday, March 9, 2016 9:35 PMSubject: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to MarketsTo: supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>

>��

Tyler ,I was wondering if you did any research concerning Short Calls during such a situation as 1987 .... Let's say there was no access , did it apply to what would be, a far out of the money short Call , pursuant to a market crash ? If the spreads are ridiculously wide and ��illiquid , can that possibly be a unforeseen margin ��problem at 5 calls per $ 100,000 , even if they were intrinsically ��profitable ?��

Thanks��

Victor��







From: "Vic Ferrari vico213@... [supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> To: "supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Wednesday, March 9, 2016 8:55 PM Subject: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] NO Access to Markets



��

Interesting video .. No Access to Markets in 87 and 89 ��... I dont understand why SPX would be any different than the stocks Sossnoff trades like TESLA , NETFLIX , IBM , FACEBOOK ��etc ... If it was 1987 Redux , he would have No Access to the Options on his stocks as well .. I wonder how long No Access lasted ... ��If anything SPX would be more liquid than his individual companies he trades .... Maybe thats why he is always Short ES but I still cant figure out how he doesn't lose money or get whipsawed in a Bull market doing that ....��







From: "Bobby Gaines bethandbob203@... [supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>

To: "supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>

Sent: Wednesday, March 9, 2016 5:36 PM

Subject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] SPX Update





��

I asked Tom Sosnoff what he really thought about Karen's style and whether he believed that she would eventually blow out her account. ��Here is his response:



"Thanks Bobby! I talked about this a bit on the show today. We've all come a long way from 2008. I'm not sure if Karen could have survived 2008 back then but today it would probably be a different story. She's an extraordinary talent and very, very rare. Most individual traders like us need to stay small and mix things up. Karen is a live inspiration but you need to have your own trading style."



He also spoke about this on the March 8 edition of Talking with Tom and Tony.�� You don't have to listen to the entire segment.�� It is the very first caller who asks the question.�� I found this to be an interesting topic.





Timing Rolling Into Strength







��

��

�� �� �� �� ��



Timing Rolling Into StrengthGot a burning trade question and need an answer fast? Call in to 855-BE-TASTY at 10am CST Mon-Fri and have your question answered live! You'll also get ...







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#6557 Mar 10 12:39 AM

Tyler,

Why do you say that the margin expectation is different between IB and TOS? Since the risk is the same on any market whatever the broker, the calculation would be the same.

Thierry



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#6558 Mar 10 2:39 AM

Yes the margin calculation would be the same - and the margin per contract would not be that much. ��However the firms also include their estimated price per contract in addition to the margin requirement. ��

In the 80s when the melt down happened the systems would not have handled the wide spreads properly. ��And it is possible that immature systems will read an illiquid super wide spread with no chance of expiring itm as something that is worth $50 - and suddenly bam - ib will apply a huge requirement on a big call position.

-Tyler

---------------From: thourat@... [supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2016 3:39 AMSubject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to MarketsTo: supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>

>��Tyler,

Why do you say that the margin expectation is different between IB and TOS? Since the risk is the same on any market whatever the broker, the calculation would be the same.

Thierry



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#6559 Mar 10 2:43 AM

Hi,

I have been following the dialogue for a few months now. I was wondering Tyler, what do you mean by IB will apply a huge requirement? Is it a fee or will they reduce your buying power? Please clarify as I am at a crossroads as to whether I should switch from IB to TD. My account size is on the smaller side. I am open to input as well. Thanks.

MV

--------------- On Thu, 3/10/16, Tyler Jewell tylerjewell@... [supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote:



Subject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to Markets

To: supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com, supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com

Date: Thursday, March 10, 2016, 4:39 AM





.



















Yes the margin calculation would be

the same - and the margin per contract would not be that

much. .However the firms also include their estimated price

per contract in addition to the margin requirement.

.

In the 80s when the

melt down happened the systems would not have handled the

wide spreads properly. .And it is possible that immature

systems will read an illiquid super wide spread with no

chance of expiring itm as something that is worth $50 - and

suddenly bam - ib will apply a huge requirement on a big

call position.



-Tyler

---------------

From: thourat@... [supertraderkarenstudy]

supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>

Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2016 3:39 AM

Subject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO

Access to Markets

To:

supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>













.







Tyler,



Why do you

say that the margin expectation is different between IB and TOS?

Since the

risk is the

same on any market whatever the broker, the calculation would be

the same.



Thierry







































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#6560 Mar 10 2:48 AM

Your required cash is the combination of the margin requirement and the cost of the option.

An option expiring in 3 days with a crazy high Vix that is deep otm will probably carry a $1000 margin requirement. �� The cost of the option is typically seem as the mid point of the spread on the bid ask.

Brokers have leniency in how they calculate the spread midpoint. �� There are many stories of brokers like ib taking completely bull shit price midpoints during crashes causing crazy cash requirements and putting you into auto liquidation. ��

Tda would not do that.

I can protect myself at ib by purchasing long calls further out but I hated spending the money.

-Tyler

---------------From: Maitrayee Vadali mssvadali@... [supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2016 5:43 AMSubject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to MarketsTo: supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>

>��Hi, I have been following the dialogue for a few months now. I was wondering Tyler, what do you mean by IB will apply a huge requirement? Is it a fee or will they reduce your buying power? Please clarify as I am at a crossroads as to whether I should switch from IB to TD. My account size is on the smaller side. I am open to input as well. Thanks. MV---------------

On Thu, 3/10/16, Tyler Jewell tylerjewell@... [supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Subject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to Markets To: supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com, supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com Date: Thursday, March 10, 2016, 4:39 AM �� Yes the margin calculation would be the same - and the margin per contract would not be that much. ��However the firms also include their estimated price per contract in addition to the margin requirement. �� In the 80s when the melt down happened the systems would not have handled the wide spreads properly. ��And it is possible that immature systems will read an illiquid super wide spread with no chance of expiring itm as something that is worth $50 - and suddenly bam - ib will apply a huge requirement on a big call position. -Tyler--------------- From: thourat@... [supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2016 3:39 AM Subject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to Markets To: supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> �� Tyler, Why do you say that the margin expectation is different between IB and TOS? Since the risk is the same on any market whatever the broker, the calculation would be the same. Thierry #yiv5170491361 #yiv5170491361 -- #yiv5170491361ygrp-mkp { border:1px solid #d8d8d8;font-family:Arial;margin:10px 0;padding:0 10px;} #yiv5170491361 #yiv5170491361ygrp-mkp hr { border:1px solid #d8d8d8;} #yiv5170491361 #yiv5170491361ygrp-mkp #yiv5170491361hd { color:#628c2a;font-size:85%;font-weight:700;line-height:122%;margin:10px 0;} #yiv5170491361 #yiv5170491361ygrp-mkp #yiv5170491361ads { margin-bottom:10px;} #yiv5170491361 #yiv5170491361ygrp-mkp .yiv5170491361ad { padding:0 0;} #yiv5170491361 #yiv5170491361ygrp-mkp .yiv5170491361ad p { margin:0;} #yiv5170491361 #yiv5170491361ygrp-mkp .yiv5170491361ad a { color:#0000ff;text-decoration:none;} #yiv5170491361 #yiv5170491361ygrp-sponsor #yiv5170491361ygrp-lc { font-family:Arial;} #yiv5170491361 #yiv5170491361ygrp-sponsor #yiv5170491361ygrp-lc #yiv5170491361hd { margin:10px 0px;font-weight:700;font-size:78%;line-height:122%;} #yiv5170491361 #yiv5170491361ygrp-sponsor #yiv5170491361ygrp-lc .yiv5170491361ad { 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----------------------------

#6561 Mar 10 2:58 AM

Vic

I think he losses money all the time just doesn't publicize it or trades paper, He was short the market at 1600 all the way up to 2100.

Keith



----------------------------

#6563 Mar 10 3:02 AM

Thank you so much for the clarification!

--------------- On Thu, 3/10/16, Tyler Jewell tylerjewell@... [supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote:



Subject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to Markets

To: supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com

Date: Thursday, March 10, 2016, 4:48 AM





.



















Your required cash is the combination

of the margin requirement and the cost of the

option.

An option

expiring in 3 days with a crazy high Vix that is deep otm

will probably carry a $1000 margin requirement. . The cost

of the option is typically seem as the mid point of the

spread on the bid ask.

Brokers have leniency in how they

calculate the spread midpoint. . There are many stories of

brokers like ib taking completely bull shit price midpoints

during crashes causing crazy cash requirements and putting

you into auto liquidation. .

Tda would not do that.

I can protect myself at ib by

purchasing long calls further out but I hated spending the

money.



-Tyler

---------------

From: Maitrayee Vadali mssvadali@...

[supertraderkarenstudy]

supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>

Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2016 5:43 AM

Subject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO

Access to Markets

To:

supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>













.







Hi,

I have been following the

dialogue for a few months now. I was wondering Tyler, what

do you mean by IB will apply a huge requirement? Is it a fee

or will they reduce your buying power? Please clarify as I

am at a crossroads as to whether I should switch from IB to

TD. My account size is on the smaller side. I am open to

input as well. Thanks.

MV



---------------

On Thu, 3/10/16, Tyler Jewell

tylerjewell@... [supertraderkarenstudy]

supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote:



Subject: Re:

[SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to Markets

To: supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com,

supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com

Date:

Thursday, March 10, 2016, 4:39 AM





.



















Yes the

margin calculation would be

the same - and

the margin per contract would not be that



much. .However the firms also include their estimated

price

per contract in addition to the

margin requirement.

.

In

the 80s when the

melt down happened the

systems would not have handled the

wide

spreads properly. .And it is possible that immature

systems will read an illiquid super wide

spread with no

chance of expiring itm as

something that is worth $50 - and

suddenly

bam - ib will apply a huge requirement on a big

call position.



-Tyler



---------------

From:

thourat@... [supertraderkarenstudy]



supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>

Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2016 3:39 AM

Subject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS -

NO

Access to Markets

To:





supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>













.







Tyler,



Why do you

say that the

margin expectation is different between IB and TOS?

Since the

risk is the

same on any market whatever the broker, the

calculation would be

the same.



Thierry







































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----------------------------

#6568 Mar 10 6:55 AM

Tom.s always short, but just because he.s short doesn.t mean his basis is 1600 or wherever he may be short from. he sells a crapload of premium against everything he puts on. his basis is probably over where the market is at all times because of this, and he.s always scalping around positions. I don.t think he.s going hungry based on his trading style.





On Mar 10, 2016, at 4:58 AM, keith dutter matt19.2526@... [supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote:



Vic��

I think he losses money all the time just doesn't publicize it or trades paper, He was short the market at 1600 all the way up to 2100.��

Keith



----------------------------

#6569 Mar 10 7:00 AM

Jeff is correct.. I have personally traded, on more than one occasion, with Tom.. He sells rallies and does not get out.. I have known him to be several hundred points underwater. He will keep selling, reducing the basis.. He will have many positions on as he keeps selling.. I mentioned this once to Tony who confirmed this. �� ��From: supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com [mailto:supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com] Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2016 6:55 AMTo: supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.comSubject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] NO Access to Markets



----------------------------

#6571 Mar 10 7:19 AM

Tyler , How do you know IB would calculate the midpoint differently than TOS ? Isn't a midpoint a midpoint ? Would every account in TOS be subjective when markets are crashing to ascertain whether midpoints are valid ? Does TOS have a method with short Calls , lets say , during a crash ,becoming way out of the money , to ��be ��disregarded in the margin requirement ? ��



From: "Tyler Jewell tylerjewell@... [supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> To: supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2016 5:48 AM Subject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to Markets

��Your required cash is the combination of the margin requirement and the cost of the option.

An option expiring in 3 days with a crazy high Vix that is deep otm will probably carry a $1000 margin requirement. �� The cost of the option is typically seem as the mid point of the spread on the bid ask.

Brokers have leniency in how they calculate the spread midpoint. �� There are many stories of brokers like ib taking completely bull shit price midpoints during crashes causing crazy cash requirements and putting you into auto liquidation. ��

Tda would not do that.

I can protect myself at ib by purchasing long calls further out but I hated spending the money.

-Tyler

---------------From: Maitrayee Vadali mssvadali@... [supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2016 5:43 AMSubject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to MarketsTo: supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>



��Hi, I have been following the dialogue for a few months now. I was wondering Tyler, what do you mean by IB will apply a huge requirement? Is it a fee or will they reduce your buying power? Please clarify as I am at a crossroads as to whether I should switch from IB to TD. My account size is on the smaller side. I am open to input as well. Thanks. MV--------------- On Thu, 3/10/16, Tyler Jewell tylerjewell@... [supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote: Subject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to Markets To: supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com, supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com Date: Thursday, March 10, 2016, 4:39 AM �� Yes the margin calculation would be the same - and the margin per contract would not be that much. ��However the firms also include their estimated price per contract in addition to the margin requirement. �� In the 80s when the melt down happened the systems would not have handled the wide spreads properly. ��And it is possible that immature systems will read an illiquid super wide spread with no chance of expiring itm as something that is worth $50 - and suddenly bam - ib will apply a huge requirement on a big call position. -Tyler--------------- From: thourat@... [supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2016 3:39 AM Subject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to Markets To: supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> �� Tyler, Why do you say that the margin expectation is different between IB and TOS? Since the risk is the same on any market whatever the broker, the calculation would be the same. Thierry #yiv5170491361 #yiv5170491361 -- #yiv5170491361ygrp-mkp { border:1px solid #d8d8d8;font-family:Arial;margin:10px 0;padding:0 10px;} #yiv5170491361 #yiv5170491361ygrp-mkp hr { border:1px solid #d8d8d8;} #yiv5170491361 #yiv5170491361ygrp-mkp #yiv5170491361hd { color:#628c2a;font-size:85%;font-weight:700;line-height:122%;margin:10px 0;} #yiv5170491361 #yiv5170491361ygrp-mkp #yiv5170491361ads { margin-bottom:10px;} #yiv5170491361 #yiv5170491361ygrp-mkp .yiv5170491361ad { padding:0 0;} #yiv5170491361 #yiv5170491361ygrp-mkp .yiv5170491361ad p { margin:0;} #yiv5170491361 #yiv5170491361ygrp-mkp .yiv5170491361ad a { color:#0000ff;text-decoration:none;} #yiv5170491361 #yiv5170491361ygrp-sponsor #yiv5170491361ygrp-lc { font-family:Arial;} #yiv5170491361 #yiv5170491361ygrp-sponsor #yiv5170491361ygrp-lc #yiv5170491361hd { margin:10px 0px;font-weight:700;font-size:78%;line-height:122%;} #yiv5170491361 #yiv5170491361ygrp-sponsor #yiv5170491361ygrp-lc .yiv5170491361ad { 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----------------------------

#6572 Mar 10 7:32 AM

IB has flexibility in looking at the bid & ask spreads.. If you have a spread of $.05 to $10,000 which is something that can happen in a crashing non-liquid market, those automation engines can calculate wonky things.. You know it's only worth $.05, but those engines don't.

This particular thread was about asking how it was in the 80s - these systems were not nearly as smart.. And IB is notorious for not really giving a damn about its users.. There are stories online about these odd calculations that are self-serving to them.



----------------------------

#6573 Mar 10 7:32 AM

Not answering for Tyler- But IB has an auto liquidate function - they did this on some of my positions Aug 24th as a result of what Tyler is mentioning. Those spreads were so wide on the OTM puts that it jacks everything up and they just kill your positions (at the worst possible time of course) - I literally got a margin call notice, picked up the phone to call them, and before I finished dialing the number, my positions were gone. They say they do this to control risk, it.s all automatic and computer generated. TOS on the other hand worked with me over two days and I held on and adjusted every position I had.��



Craig

On Mar 10, 2016, at 9:19 AM, Vic Ferrari vico213@... [supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote:



Tyler , How do you know IB would calculate the midpoint differently than TOS ? Isn't a midpoint a midpoint ? Would every account in TOS be subjective when markets are crashing to ascertain whether midpoints are valid ? Does TOS have a method with short Calls , lets say , during a crash ,becoming way out of the money , to ��be ��disregarded in the margin requirement ? ��



From:��"Tyler Jewell��tylerjewell@...��[supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>To:��supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com��Sent:��Thursday, March 10, 2016 5:48 AMSubject:��Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to Markets

��Your required cash is the combination of the margin requirement and the cost of the option.

An option expiring in 3 days with a crazy high Vix that is deep otm will probably carry a $1000 margin requirement. �� The cost of the option is typically seem as the mid point of the spread on the bid ask.

Brokers have leniency in how they calculate the spread midpoint. �� There are many stories of brokers like ib taking completely bull shit price midpoints during crashes causing crazy cash requirements and putting you into auto liquidation. ��

Tda would not do that.

I can protect myself at ib by purchasing long calls further out but I hated spending the money.

-Tyler

---------------From: Maitrayee Vadali��mssvadali@...��[supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2016 5:43 AMSubject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to MarketsTo: supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>

��Hi,I have been following the dialogue for a few months now. I was wondering Tyler, what do you mean by IB will apply a huge requirement? Is it a fee or will they reduce your buying power? Please clarify as I am at a crossroads as to whether I should switch from IB to TD. My account size is on the smaller side. I am open to input as well. Thanks.MV---------------On Thu, 3/10/16, Tyler Jewell��tylerjewell@...��[supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Subject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to MarketsTo:��supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com,��supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.comDate: Thursday, March 10, 2016, 4:39 AM

��









Yes the margin calculation would bethe same - and the margin per contract would not be thatmuch. ��However the firms also include their estimated priceper contract in addition to the margin requirement.��In the 80s when themelt down happened the systems would not have handled thewide spreads properly. ��And it is possible that immaturesystems will read an illiquid super wide spread with nochance of expiring itm as something that is worth $50 - andsuddenly bam - ib will apply a huge requirement on a bigcall position.

-Tyler---------------From:��thourat@...��[supertraderkarenstudy]supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2016 3:39 AMSubject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NOAccess to MarketsTo:��supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>





����



Tyler,

Why do yousay that the margin expectation is different between IB and TOS?Since therisk is thesame on any market whatever the broker, the calculation would bethe same.

Thierry



















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----------------------------

#6574 Mar 10 7:37 AM

Thanks Tyler and Craig ... I'm switching over from those automatons to TOS



From: "Craig Falwell mcfalwell@... [supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> To: supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2016 10:32 AM Subject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to Markets

��Not answering for Tyler- But IB has an auto liquidate function - they did this on some of my positions Aug 24th as a result of what Tyler is mentioning. Those spreads were so wide on the OTM puts that it jacks everything up and they just kill your positions (at the worst possible time of course) - I literally got a margin call notice, picked up the phone to call them, and before I finished dialing the number, my positions were gone. They say they do this to control risk, it.s all automatic and computer generated. TOS on the other hand worked with me over two days and I held on and adjusted every position I had.��



Craig

On Mar 10, 2016, at 9:19 AM, Vic Ferrari vico213@... [supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote:



Tyler , How do you know IB would calculate the midpoint differently than TOS ? Isn't a midpoint a midpoint ? Would every account in TOS be subjective when markets are crashing to ascertain whether midpoints are valid ? Does TOS have a method with short Calls , lets say , during a crash ,becoming way out of the money , to ��be ��disregarded in the margin requirement ? ��



From:��"Tyler Jewell��tylerjewell@...��[supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>To:��supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com��Sent:��Thursday, March 10, 2016 5:48 AMSubject:��Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to Markets

��Your required cash is the combination of the margin requirement and the cost of the option.

An option expiring in 3 days with a crazy high Vix that is deep otm will probably carry a $1000 margin requirement. �� The cost of the option is typically seem as the mid point of the spread on the bid ask.

Brokers have leniency in how they calculate the spread midpoint. �� There are many stories of brokers like ib taking completely bull shit price midpoints during crashes causing crazy cash requirements and putting you into auto liquidation. ��

Tda would not do that.

I can protect myself at ib by purchasing long calls further out but I hated spending the money.

-Tyler

---------------From: Maitrayee Vadali��mssvadali@...��[supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2016 5:43 AMSubject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to MarketsTo: supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>

��Hi,I have been following the dialogue for a few months now. I was wondering Tyler, what do you mean by IB will apply a huge requirement? Is it a fee or will they reduce your buying power? Please clarify as I am at a crossroads as to whether I should switch from IB to TD. My account size is on the smaller side. I am open to input as well. Thanks.MV---------------On Thu, 3/10/16, Tyler Jewell��tylerjewell@...��[supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Subject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to MarketsTo:��supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com,��supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.comDate: Thursday, March 10, 2016, 4:39 AM

��









Yes the margin calculation would bethe same - and the margin per contract would not be thatmuch. ��However the firms also include their estimated priceper contract in addition to the margin requirement.��In the 80s when themelt down happened the systems would not have handled thewide spreads properly. ��And it is possible that immaturesystems will read an illiquid super wide spread with nochance of expiring itm as something that is worth $50 - andsuddenly bam - ib will apply a huge requirement on a bigcall position.

-Tyler---------------From:��thourat@...��[supertraderkarenstudy]supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2016 3:39 AMSubject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NOAccess to MarketsTo:��supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>





����



Tyler,

Why do yousay that the margin expectation is different between IB and TOS?Since therisk is thesame on any market whatever the broker, the calculation would bethe same.

Thierry



















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----------------------------

#6575 Mar 10 7:51 AM

There are a couple things you can do on IB rather than TOS, one is rolling futures options, 2 is that you can borrow cash against your account. but those two things alone didn.t keep me there after the auto liquidate :-)

Craig





On Mar 10, 2016, at 9:37 AM, Vic Ferrari vico213@... [supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote:



Thanks Tyler and Craig ... I'm switching over from those automatons to TOS



From:��"Craig Falwell��mcfalwell@...��[supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>To:��supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com��Sent:��Thursday, March 10, 2016 10:32 AMSubject:��Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to Markets

��Not answering for Tyler- But IB has an auto liquidate function - they did this on some of my positions Aug 24th as a result of what Tyler is mentioning. Those spreads were so wide on the OTM puts that it jacks everything up and they just kill your positions (at the worst possible time of course) - I literally got a margin call notice, picked up the phone to call them, and before I finished dialing the number, my positions were gone. They say they do this to control risk, it.s all automatic and computer generated. TOS on the other hand worked with me over two days and I held on and adjusted every position I had.��



Craig

On Mar 10, 2016, at 9:19 AM, Vic Ferrari��vico213@...��[supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote:



Tyler , How do you know IB would calculate the midpoint differently than TOS ? Isn't a midpoint a midpoint ? Would every account in TOS be subjective when markets are crashing to ascertain whether midpoints are valid ? Does TOS have a method with short Calls , lets say , during a crash ,becoming way out of the money , to ��be ��disregarded in the margin requirement ? ��



From:��"Tyler Jewell��tylerjewell@...��[supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>To:��supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com��Sent:��Thursday, March 10, 2016 5:48 AMSubject:��Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to Markets

��Your required cash is the combination of the margin requirement and the cost of the option.

An option expiring in 3 days with a crazy high Vix that is deep otm will probably carry a $1000 margin requirement. �� The cost of the option is typically seem as the mid point of the spread on the bid ask.

Brokers have leniency in how they calculate the spread midpoint. �� There are many stories of brokers like ib taking completely bull shit price midpoints during crashes causing crazy cash requirements and putting you into auto liquidation. ��

Tda would not do that.

I can protect myself at ib by purchasing long calls further out but I hated spending the money.

-Tyler

---------------From: Maitrayee Vadali��mssvadali@...��[supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2016 5:43 AMSubject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to MarketsTo: supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>

��Hi,I have been following the dialogue for a few months now. I was wondering Tyler, what do you mean by IB will apply a huge requirement? Is it a fee or will they reduce your buying power? Please clarify as I am at a crossroads as to whether I should switch from IB to TD. My account size is on the smaller side. I am open to input as well. Thanks.MV---------------On Thu, 3/10/16, Tyler Jewell��tylerjewell@...��[supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Subject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to MarketsTo:��supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com,��supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.comDate: Thursday, March 10, 2016, 4:39 AM

��









Yes the margin calculation would bethe same - and the margin per contract would not be thatmuch. ��However the firms also include their estimated priceper contract in addition to the margin requirement.��In the 80s when themelt down happened the systems would not have handled thewide spreads properly. ��And it is possible that immaturesystems will read an illiquid super wide spread with nochance of expiring itm as something that is worth $50 - andsuddenly bam - ib will apply a huge requirement on a bigcall position.

-Tyler---------------From:��thourat@...��[supertraderkarenstudy]supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2016 3:39 AMSubject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NOAccess to MarketsTo:��supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>





����



Tyler,

Why do yousay that the margin expectation is different between IB and TOS?Since therisk is thesame on any market whatever the broker, the calculation would bethe same.

Thierry



















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----------------------------

#6576 Mar 10 7:59 AM

I wish I was lucky as all you guys!Here in Europe practically no Tda. Only IB and so no ToS account...But I am doing quite well although I have a smaller account.--.

Giovanni Pugliese Carratelli

giovax@....|.www.giovax.com.

Skype: giovax | LinkedIn:.linkedin.com/in/giovax

Mobile IT:.+39 347 944 5184.| Mobile UK:.+44 0799 932 8167On 10 Mar 2016 3:51 p.m., "Craig Falwell mcfalwell@... [supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

.There are a couple things you can do on IB rather than TOS, one is rolling futures options, 2 is that you can borrow cash against your account. but those two things alone didn.t keep me there after the auto liquidate :-)

Craig





On Mar 10, 2016, at 9:37 AM, Vic Ferrari vico213@... [supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote:



Thanks Tyler and Craig ... I'm switching over from those automatons to TOS



From:."Craig Falwell.mcfalwell@....[supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>To:.supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com.Sent:.Thursday, March 10, 2016 10:32 AMSubject:.Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to Markets

.Not answering for Tyler- But IB has an auto liquidate function - they did this on some of my positions Aug 24th as a result of what Tyler is mentioning. Those spreads were so wide on the OTM puts that it jacks everything up and they just kill your positions (at the worst possible time of course) - I literally got a margin call notice, picked up the phone to call them, and before I finished dialing the number, my positions were gone. They say they do this to control risk, it.s all automatic and computer generated. TOS on the other hand worked with me over two days and I held on and adjusted every position I had..



Craig

On Mar 10, 2016, at 9:19 AM, Vic Ferrari.vico213@....[supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote:



Tyler , How do you know IB would calculate the midpoint differently than TOS ? Isn't a midpoint a midpoint ? Would every account in TOS be subjective when markets are crashing to ascertain whether midpoints are valid ? Does TOS have a method with short Calls , lets say , during a crash ,becoming way out of the money , to .be .disregarded in the margin requirement ? .



From:."Tyler Jewell.tylerjewell@....[supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>To:.supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com.Sent:.Thursday, March 10, 2016 5:48 AMSubject:.Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to Markets

.Your required cash is the combination of the margin requirement and the cost of the option.

An option expiring in 3 days with a crazy high Vix that is deep otm will probably carry a $1000 margin requirement. . The cost of the option is typically seem as the mid point of the spread on the bid ask.

Brokers have leniency in how they calculate the spread midpoint. . There are many stories of brokers like ib taking completely bull shit price midpoints during crashes causing crazy cash requirements and putting you into auto liquidation. .

Tda would not do that.

I can protect myself at ib by purchasing long calls further out but I hated spending the money.

-Tyler

---------------From: Maitrayee Vadali.mssvadali@....[supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2016 5:43 AMSubject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to MarketsTo: supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>

.Hi,I have been following the dialogue for a few months now. I was wondering Tyler, what do you mean by IB will apply a huge requirement? Is it a fee or will they reduce your buying power? Please clarify as I am at a crossroads as to whether I should switch from IB to TD. My account size is on the smaller side. I am open to input as well. Thanks.MV---------------On Thu, 3/10/16, Tyler Jewell.tylerjewell@....[supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Subject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to MarketsTo:.supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com,.supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.comDate: Thursday, March 10, 2016, 4:39 AM

.









Yes the margin calculation would bethe same - and the margin per contract would not be thatmuch.. However the firms also include their estimated priceper contract in addition to the margin requirement..In the 80s when themelt down happened the systems would not have handled thewide spreads properly.. And it is possible that immaturesystems will read an illiquid super wide spread with nochance of expiring itm as something that is worth $50 - andsuddenly bam - ib will apply a huge requirement on a bigcall position.

-Tyler---------------From:.thourat@....[supertraderkarenstudy]supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2016 3:39 AMSubject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NOAccess to MarketsTo:.supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>





..



Tyler,

Why do yousay that the margin expectation is different between IB and TOS?Since therisk is thesame on any market whatever the broker, the calculation would bethe same.

Thierry



















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----------------------------

#6577 Mar 10 8:46 AM

Before I get started on the margin discussion, Keith, if you wantto send me your log, I.ll put it on the Dropbox for everyone.��Now, I almost hate to get into a margin discussion, especially on adown day, since when I talk about margin, it seems to push the market downfurther. ��However, I.d like to remind you that each broker implements themargin requirements differently. They are given a baseline minimum set ofrequirements to work from. From that point on, they use their own risk controlguidelines to further tweak their calculations and rules. That is one reason whymid-points and margin requirements, etc. will be different between brokers. ��In addition.....��They all reserve the right to change the calculations (and, essentially,the rules) at ANY time. So, while you are discussing a certain type ofsituation and what MIGHT happen, remember that if, and when, it does happen .they may change the rules on you. So, don.t count on anything being 100%guaranteed. ��It.s good to get experiential data from what others have gonethrough here (which, we all appreciate very much!). But, when in doubt abouthow your broker does something, call them.��Hope you all have a good day trading today. If I were betting, Iwould bet Keith is furiously selling 2 delta puts today.finally, a little juiceadded back in.

Ralph



----------------------------

#6578 Mar 10 8:53 AM

Try to see if you can open a US based company and then you can trade under that entity.



From: "Giovanni Pugliese Carratelli giovax@... [supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> To: supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2016 5:59 PM Subject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to Markets

��I wish I was lucky as all you guys!Here in Europe practically no Tda. Only IB and so no ToS account...But I am doing quite well although I have a smaller account.--��

Giovanni Pugliese Carratelli

giovax@...��|��www.giovax.com��

Skype: giovax | LinkedIn:��linkedin.com/in/giovax

Mobile IT:��+39 347 944 5184��| Mobile UK:��+44 0799 932 8167On 10 Mar 2016 3:51 p.m., "Craig Falwell mcfalwell@... [supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

��There are a couple things you can do on IB rather than TOS, one is rolling futures options, 2 is that you can borrow cash against your account. but those two things alone didn.t keep me there after the auto liquidate :-)

Craig





On Mar 10, 2016, at 9:37 AM, Vic Ferrari vico213@... [supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote:



Thanks Tyler and Craig ... I'm switching over from those automatons to TOS



From:��"Craig Falwell��mcfalwell@...��[supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>To:��supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com��Sent:��Thursday, March 10, 2016 10:32 AMSubject:��Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to Markets

��Not answering for Tyler- But IB has an auto liquidate function - they did this on some of my positions Aug 24th as a result of what Tyler is mentioning. Those spreads were so wide on the OTM puts that it jacks everything up and they just kill your positions (at the worst possible time of course) - I literally got a margin call notice, picked up the phone to call them, and before I finished dialing the number, my positions were gone. They say they do this to control risk, it.s all automatic and computer generated. TOS on the other hand worked with me over two days and I held on and adjusted every position I had.��



Craig

On Mar 10, 2016, at 9:19 AM, Vic Ferrari��vico213@...��[supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote:



Tyler , How do you know IB would calculate the midpoint differently than TOS ? Isn't a midpoint a midpoint ? Would every account in TOS be subjective when markets are crashing to ascertain whether midpoints are valid ? Does TOS have a method with short Calls , lets say , during a crash ,becoming way out of the money , to ��be ��disregarded in the margin requirement ? ��



From:��"Tyler Jewell��tylerjewell@...��[supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>To:��supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com��Sent:��Thursday, March 10, 2016 5:48 AMSubject:��Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to Markets

��Your required cash is the combination of the margin requirement and the cost of the option.

An option expiring in 3 days with a crazy high Vix that is deep otm will probably carry a $1000 margin requirement. �� The cost of the option is typically seem as the mid point of the spread on the bid ask.

Brokers have leniency in how they calculate the spread midpoint. �� There are many stories of brokers like ib taking completely bull shit price midpoints during crashes causing crazy cash requirements and putting you into auto liquidation. ��

Tda would not do that.

I can protect myself at ib by purchasing long calls further out but I hated spending the money.

-Tyler

---------------From: Maitrayee Vadali��mssvadali@...��[supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2016 5:43 AMSubject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to MarketsTo: supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>

��Hi,I have been following the dialogue for a few months now. I was wondering Tyler, what do you mean by IB will apply a huge requirement? Is it a fee or will they reduce your buying power? Please clarify as I am at a crossroads as to whether I should switch from IB to TD. My account size is on the smaller side. I am open to input as well. Thanks.MV---------------On Thu, 3/10/16, Tyler Jewell��tylerjewell@...��[supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Subject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to MarketsTo:��supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com,��supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.comDate: Thursday, March 10, 2016, 4:39 AM

��









Yes the margin calculation would bethe same - and the margin per contract would not be thatmuch.�� However the firms also include their estimated priceper contract in addition to the margin requirement.��In the 80s when themelt down happened the systems would not have handled thewide spreads properly.�� And it is possible that immaturesystems will read an illiquid super wide spread with nochance of expiring itm as something that is worth $50 - andsuddenly bam - ib will apply a huge requirement on a bigcall position.

-Tyler---------------From:��thourat@...��[supertraderkarenstudy]supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2016 3:39 AMSubject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NOAccess to MarketsTo:��supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>





����



Tyler,

Why do yousay that the margin expectation is different between IB and TOS?Since therisk is thesame on any market whatever the broker, the calculation would bethe same.

Thierry



















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----------------------------

#6579 Mar 10 9:08 AM

Hi all,��

just joined to this group to see if i can contribute on decipering karen the super trader method

as some of you i don't have Tos, but i use it on paper to analyze my trades i've an IB account and I'm trying to get a set of rules to replicate karen's method on iwm (lower margin requirements and liquid enough) but instead of using strangles using IC



----------------------------

#6580 Mar 10 9:38 AM

Hi Elad,

............ It is possibile but I believe it would cost me quite a bit to set up. I am working on growing capital and opening such company would reduce, invetiably, my trading capital.Sorry all for the OT.

--.

Giovanni Pugliese Carratelli

giovax@....|.www.giovax.com.

Skype: giovax | LinkedIn:.linkedin.com/in/giovax

Mobile IT:.+39 347 944 5184.| Mobile UK:.+44 0799 932 8167On 10 Mar 2016 4:56 p.m., "Elad Katzir eladkatzir@... [supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

.Try to see if you can open a US based company and then you can trade under that entity.



From: "Giovanni Pugliese Carratelli giovax@... [supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> To: supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2016 5:59 PM Subject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to Markets

.I wish I was lucky as all you guys!Here in Europe practically no Tda. Only IB and so no ToS account...But I am doing quite well although I have a smaller account.--.

Giovanni Pugliese Carratelli

giovax@....|.www.giovax.com.

Skype: giovax | LinkedIn:.linkedin.com/in/giovax

Mobile IT:.+39 347 944 5184.| Mobile UK:.+44 0799 932 8167On 10 Mar 2016 3:51 p.m., "Craig Falwell mcfalwell@... [supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

.There are a couple things you can do on IB rather than TOS, one is rolling futures options, 2 is that you can borrow cash against your account. but those two things alone didn.t keep me there after the auto liquidate :-)

Craig





On Mar 10, 2016, at 9:37 AM, Vic Ferrari vico213@... [supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote:



Thanks Tyler and Craig ... I'm switching over from those automatons to TOS



From:."Craig Falwell.mcfalwell@....[supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>To:.supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com.Sent:.Thursday, March 10, 2016 10:32 AMSubject:.Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to Markets

.Not answering for Tyler- But IB has an auto liquidate function - they did this on some of my positions Aug 24th as a result of what Tyler is mentioning. Those spreads were so wide on the OTM puts that it jacks everything up and they just kill your positions (at the worst possible time of course) - I literally got a margin call notice, picked up the phone to call them, and before I finished dialing the number, my positions were gone. They say they do this to control risk, it.s all automatic and computer generated. TOS on the other hand worked with me over two days and I held on and adjusted every position I had..



Craig

On Mar 10, 2016, at 9:19 AM, Vic Ferrari.vico213@....[supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote:



Tyler , How do you know IB would calculate the midpoint differently than TOS ? Isn't a midpoint a midpoint ? Would every account in TOS be subjective when markets are crashing to ascertain whether midpoints are valid ? Does TOS have a method with short Calls , lets say , during a crash ,becoming way out of the money , to .be .disregarded in the margin requirement ? .



From:."Tyler Jewell.tylerjewell@....[supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>To:.supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com.Sent:.Thursday, March 10, 2016 5:48 AMSubject:.Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to Markets

.Your required cash is the combination of the margin requirement and the cost of the option.

An option expiring in 3 days with a crazy high Vix that is deep otm will probably carry a $1000 margin requirement. . The cost of the option is typically seem as the mid point of the spread on the bid ask.

Brokers have leniency in how they calculate the spread midpoint. . There are many stories of brokers like ib taking completely bull shit price midpoints during crashes causing crazy cash requirements and putting you into auto liquidation. .

Tda would not do that.

I can protect myself at ib by purchasing long calls further out but I hated spending the money.

-Tyler

---------------From: Maitrayee Vadali.mssvadali@....[supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2016 5:43 AMSubject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to MarketsTo: supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>

.Hi,I have been following the dialogue for a few months now. I was wondering Tyler, what do you mean by IB will apply a huge requirement? Is it a fee or will they reduce your buying power? Please clarify as I am at a crossroads as to whether I should switch from IB to TD. My account size is on the smaller side. I am open to input as well. Thanks.MV---------------On Thu, 3/10/16, Tyler Jewell.tylerjewell@....[supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Subject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to MarketsTo:.supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com,.supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.comDate: Thursday, March 10, 2016, 4:39 AM

.









Yes the margin calculation would bethe same - and the margin per contract would not be thatmuch.. However the firms also include their estimated priceper contract in addition to the margin requirement..In the 80s when themelt down happened the systems would not have handled thewide spreads properly.. And it is possible that immaturesystems will read an illiquid super wide spread with nochance of expiring itm as something that is worth $50 - andsuddenly bam - ib will apply a huge requirement on a bigcall position.

-Tyler---------------From:.thourat@....[supertraderkarenstudy]supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2016 3:39 AMSubject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NOAccess to MarketsTo:.supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>





..



Tyler,

Why do yousay that the margin expectation is different between IB and TOS?Since therisk is thesame on any market whatever the broker, the calculation would bethe same.

Thierry



















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----------------------------

#6586 Mar 10 6:33 PM

100% agree with Tyler and Craig.

That's why anyone who trade "naked" ( I am talking Calls��or Puts����) should be very careful with IB.If you do simple trades, IB may be good but IMHO the fee comes out same to TOS if you add all the order change, data etc..

TOS was awesome , even in Aug 24th , when I was 'out of country' where connections was not good , I called them on Skype and they were so nice and I did trade with them on Skype ( I don't have any affiliations with TOS) over 2 days.

I was with IB for 15+ years and when I asked them for stupid exposure fee calculation to prevent my positions, they gave me the standard answer to buy LONG calls/PUTs and the exposure fee calculation is proprietary..

They also gave standard answer it's to protect me :) LMAO.. I said bye bye..

On the other hand, TOS Analyze gives you very clear calculation and even if the market dries up and if your entire portfolio is within -2 X Nettliquid for -20% drop , you are safe till the next day.

CheersMN











On Thursday, March 10, 2016 9:38 AM, "Giovanni Pugliese Carratelli giovax@... [supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote:



��Hi Elad,

������������������������ It is possibile but I believe it would cost me quite a bit to set up. I am working on growing capital and opening such company would reduce, invetiably, my trading capital.Sorry all for the OT.

--��

Giovanni Pugliese Carratelli

giovax@...��|��www.giovax.com/��

Skype: giovax | LinkedIn:��linkedin.com/in/giovax

Mobile IT:��+39 347 944 5184��| Mobile UK:��+44 0799 932 8167On 10 Mar 2016 4:56 p.m., "Elad Katzir eladkatzir@... [supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

��Try to see if you can open a US based company and then you can trade under that entity.



From: "Giovanni Pugliese Carratelli giovax@... [supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> To: supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2016 5:59 PM Subject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to Markets



��I wish I was lucky as all you guys!Here in Europe practically no Tda. Only IB and so no ToS account...But I am doing quite well although I have a smaller account.--��

Giovanni Pugliese Carratelli

giovax@...��|��www.giovax.com/��

Skype: giovax | LinkedIn:��linkedin.com/in/giovax

Mobile IT:��+39 347 944 5184��| Mobile UK:��+44 0799 932 8167On 10 Mar 2016 3:51 p.m., "Craig Falwell mcfalwell@... [supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

��There are a couple things you can do on IB rather than TOS, one is rolling futures options, 2 is that you can borrow cash against your account. but those two things alone didn.t keep me there after the auto liquidate :-)

Craig





On Mar 10, 2016, at 9:37 AM, Vic Ferrari vico213@... [supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote:



Thanks Tyler and Craig ... I'm switching over from those automatons to TOS



From:��"Craig Falwell��mcfalwell@...��[supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>To:��supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com��Sent:��Thursday, March 10, 2016 10:32 AMSubject:��Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to Markets

��Not answering for Tyler- But IB has an auto liquidate function - they did this on some of my positions Aug 24th as a result of what Tyler is mentioning. Those spreads were so wide on the OTM puts that it jacks everything up and they just kill your positions (at the worst possible time of course) - I literally got a margin call notice, picked up the phone to call them, and before I finished dialing the number, my positions were gone. They say they do this to control risk, it.s all automatic and computer generated. TOS on the other hand worked with me over two days and I held on and adjusted every position I had.��



Craig

On Mar 10, 2016, at 9:19 AM, Vic Ferrari��vico213@...��[supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote:



Tyler , How do you know IB would calculate the midpoint differently than TOS ? Isn't a midpoint a midpoint ? Would every account in TOS be subjective when markets are crashing to ascertain whether midpoints are valid ? Does TOS have a method with short Calls , lets say , during a crash ,becoming way out of the money , to ��be ��disregarded in the margin requirement ? ��



From:��"Tyler Jewell��tylerjewell@...��[supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>To:��supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com��Sent:��Thursday, March 10, 2016 5:48 AMSubject:��Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to Markets

��Your required cash is the combination of the margin requirement and the cost of the option.

An option expiring in 3 days with a crazy high Vix that is deep otm will probably carry a $1000 margin requirement. �� The cost of the option is typically seem as the mid point of the spread on the bid ask.

Brokers have leniency in how they calculate the spread midpoint. �� There are many stories of brokers like ib taking completely bull shit price midpoints during crashes causing crazy cash requirements and putting you into auto liquidation. ��

Tda would not do that.

I can protect myself at ib by purchasing long calls further out but I hated spending the money.

-Tyler

---------------From: Maitrayee Vadali��mssvadali@...��[supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2016 5:43 AMSubject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to MarketsTo: supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>

��Hi,I have been following the dialogue for a few months now. I was wondering Tyler, what do you mean by IB will apply a huge requirement? Is it a fee or will they reduce your buying power? Please clarify as I am at a crossroads as to whether I should switch from IB to TD. My account size is on the smaller side. I am open to input as well. Thanks.MV---------------On Thu, 3/10/16, Tyler Jewell��tylerjewell@...��[supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Subject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to MarketsTo:��supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com,��supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.comDate: Thursday, March 10, 2016, 4:39 AM

��









Yes the margin calculation would bethe same - and the margin per contract would not be thatmuch.�� However the firms also include their estimated priceper contract in addition to the margin requirement.��In the 80s when themelt down happened the systems would not have handled thewide spreads properly.�� And it is possible that immaturesystems will read an illiquid super wide spread with nochance of expiring itm as something that is worth $50 - andsuddenly bam - ib will apply a huge requirement on a bigcall position.

-Tyler---------------From:��thourat@...��[supertraderkarenstudy]supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2016 3:39 AMSubject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NOAccess to MarketsTo:��supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>





����



Tyler,

Why do yousay that the margin expectation is different between IB and TOS?Since therisk is thesame on any market whatever the broker, the calculation would bethe same.

Thierry



















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----------------------------

#6587 Mar 11 1:31 PM

Thank you Tyler, Craig and all for your explanations and contributions.I appreciate very much.Have a great week-end all.Thierry



Le Vendredi 11 mars 2016 3h36, "get_easyman get_easyman@... [supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> a .crit :



��100% agree with Tyler and Craig.

That's why anyone who trade "naked" ( I am talking Calls��or Puts����) should be very careful with IB.If you do simple trades, IB may be good but IMHO the fee comes out same to TOS if you add all the order change, data etc..

TOS was awesome , even in Aug 24th , when I was 'out of country' where connections was not good , I called them on Skype and they were so nice and I did trade with them on Skype ( I don't have any affiliations with TOS) over 2 days.

I was with IB for 15+ years and when I asked them for stupid exposure fee calculation to prevent my positions, they gave me the standard answer to buy LONG calls/PUTs and the exposure fee calculation is proprietary..

They also gave standard answer it's to protect me :) LMAO.. I said bye bye..

On the other hand, TOS Analyze gives you very clear calculation and even if the market dries up and if your entire portfolio is within -2 X Nettliquid for -20% drop , you are safe till the next day.

CheersMN











On Thursday, March 10, 2016 9:38 AM, "Giovanni Pugliese Carratelli giovax@... [supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote:



��Hi Elad,

������������������������ It is possibile but I believe it would cost me quite a bit to set up. I am working on growing capital and opening such company would reduce, invetiably, my trading capital.Sorry all for the OT.

--��

Giovanni Pugliese Carratelli

giovax@...��|��www.giovax.com/��

Skype: giovax | LinkedIn:��linkedin.com/in/giovax

Mobile IT:��+39 347 944 5184��| Mobile UK:��+44 0799 932 8167On 10 Mar 2016 4:56 p.m., "Elad Katzir eladkatzir@... [supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

��Try to see if you can open a US based company and then you can trade under that entity.



From: "Giovanni Pugliese Carratelli giovax@... [supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> To: supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2016 5:59 PM Subject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to Markets



��I wish I was lucky as all you guys!Here in Europe practically no Tda. Only IB and so no ToS account...But I am doing quite well although I have a smaller account.--��

Giovanni Pugliese Carratelli

giovax@...��|��www.giovax.com/��

Skype: giovax | LinkedIn:��linkedin.com/in/giovax

Mobile IT:��+39 347 944 5184��| Mobile UK:��+44 0799 932 8167On 10 Mar 2016 3:51 p.m., "Craig Falwell mcfalwell@... [supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

��There are a couple things you can do on IB rather than TOS, one is rolling futures options, 2 is that you can borrow cash against your account. but those two things alone didn.t keep me there after the auto liquidate :-)

Craig





On Mar 10, 2016, at 9:37 AM, Vic Ferrari vico213@... [supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote:



Thanks Tyler and Craig ... I'm switching over from those automatons to TOS



From:��"Craig Falwell��mcfalwell@...��[supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>To:��supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com��Sent:��Thursday, March 10, 2016 10:32 AMSubject:��Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to Markets

��Not answering for Tyler- But IB has an auto liquidate function - they did this on some of my positions Aug 24th as a result of what Tyler is mentioning. Those spreads were so wide on the OTM puts that it jacks everything up and they just kill your positions (at the worst possible time of course) - I literally got a margin call notice, picked up the phone to call them, and before I finished dialing the number, my positions were gone. They say they do this to control risk, it.s all automatic and computer generated. TOS on the other hand worked with me over two days and I held on and adjusted every position I had.��



Craig

On Mar 10, 2016, at 9:19 AM, Vic Ferrari��vico213@...��[supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote:



Tyler , How do you know IB would calculate the midpoint differently than TOS ? Isn't a midpoint a midpoint ? Would every account in TOS be subjective when markets are crashing to ascertain whether midpoints are valid ? Does TOS have a method with short Calls , lets say , during a crash ,becoming way out of the money , to ��be ��disregarded in the margin requirement ? ��



From:��"Tyler Jewell��tylerjewell@...��[supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>To:��supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com��Sent:��Thursday, March 10, 2016 5:48 AMSubject:��Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to Markets

��Your required cash is the combination of the margin requirement and the cost of the option.

An option expiring in 3 days with a crazy high Vix that is deep otm will probably carry a $1000 margin requirement. �� The cost of the option is typically seem as the mid point of the spread on the bid ask.

Brokers have leniency in how they calculate the spread midpoint. �� There are many stories of brokers like ib taking completely bull shit price midpoints during crashes causing crazy cash requirements and putting you into auto liquidation. ��

Tda would not do that.

I can protect myself at ib by purchasing long calls further out but I hated spending the money.

-Tyler

---------------From: Maitrayee Vadali��mssvadali@...��[supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2016 5:43 AMSubject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to MarketsTo: supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>

��Hi,I have been following the dialogue for a few months now. I was wondering Tyler, what do you mean by IB will apply a huge requirement? Is it a fee or will they reduce your buying power? Please clarify as I am at a crossroads as to whether I should switch from IB to TD. My account size is on the smaller side. I am open to input as well. Thanks.MV---------------On Thu, 3/10/16, Tyler Jewell��tylerjewell@...��[supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Subject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to MarketsTo:��supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com,��supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.comDate: Thursday, March 10, 2016, 4:39 AM

��









Yes the margin calculation would bethe same - and the margin per contract would not be thatmuch.�� However the firms also include their estimated priceper contract in addition to the margin requirement.��In the 80s when themelt down happened the systems would not have handled thewide spreads properly.�� And it is possible that immaturesystems will read an illiquid super wide spread with nochance of expiring itm as something that is worth $50 - andsuddenly bam - ib will apply a huge requirement on a bigcall position.

-Tyler---------------From:��thourat@...��[supertraderkarenstudy]supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2016 3:39 AMSubject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NOAccess to MarketsTo:��supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>





����



Tyler,

Why do yousay that the margin expectation is different between IB and TOS?Since therisk is thesame on any market whatever the broker, the calculation would bethe same.

Thierry



















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----------------------------

#6589 Mar 11 2:13 PM

Spoke to Interactive today ... They do not do the Margin call thing ... Not their style :) ��IF your Excess Liquidity is 0 or below , they auto liquidate .. No ifs , ands or buts ... Not sure when TOS puts you in a Margin Call , but if they waited till your excess liquidity is 0 , it would seem they would be taking on a lot of risk to work with you at that point��



From: "HOURAT Thierry thourat@... [supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> To: "supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Friday, March 11, 2016 4:31 PM Subject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to Markets

��Thank you Tyler, Craig and all for your explanations and contributions.I appreciate very much.Have a great week-end all.Thierry



Le Vendredi 11 mars 2016 3h36, "get_easyman get_easyman@... [supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> a .crit :



��100% agree with Tyler and Craig.

That's why anyone who trade "naked" ( I am talking Calls��or Puts����) should be very careful with IB.If you do simple trades, IB may be good but IMHO the fee comes out same to TOS if you add all the order change, data etc..

TOS was awesome , even in Aug 24th , when I was 'out of country' where connections was not good , I called them on Skype and they were so nice and I did trade with them on Skype ( I don't have any affiliations with TOS) over 2 days.

I was with IB for 15+ years and when I asked them for stupid exposure fee calculation to prevent my positions, they gave me the standard answer to buy LONG calls/PUTs and the exposure fee calculation is proprietary..

They also gave standard answer it's to protect me :) LMAO.. I said bye bye..

On the other hand, TOS Analyze gives you very clear calculation and even if the market dries up and if your entire portfolio is within -2 X Nettliquid for -20% drop , you are safe till the next day.

CheersMN











On Thursday, March 10, 2016 9:38 AM, "Giovanni Pugliese Carratelli giovax@... [supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote:



��Hi Elad,

������������������������ It is possibile but I believe it would cost me quite a bit to set up. I am working on growing capital and opening such company would reduce, invetiably, my trading capital.Sorry all for the OT.

--��

Giovanni Pugliese Carratelli

giovax@...��|��www.giovax.com/��

Skype: giovax | LinkedIn:��linkedin.com/in/giovax

Mobile IT:��+39 347 944 5184��| Mobile UK:��+44 0799 932 8167On 10 Mar 2016 4:56 p.m., "Elad Katzir eladkatzir@... [supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

��Try to see if you can open a US based company and then you can trade under that entity.



From: "Giovanni Pugliese Carratelli giovax@... [supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> To: supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2016 5:59 PM Subject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to Markets



��I wish I was lucky as all you guys!Here in Europe practically no Tda. Only IB and so no ToS account...But I am doing quite well although I have a smaller account.--��

Giovanni Pugliese Carratelli

giovax@...��|��www.giovax.com/��

Skype: giovax | LinkedIn:��linkedin.com/in/giovax

Mobile IT:��+39 347 944 5184��| Mobile UK:��+44 0799 932 8167On 10 Mar 2016 3:51 p.m., "Craig Falwell mcfalwell@... [supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

��There are a couple things you can do on IB rather than TOS, one is rolling futures options, 2 is that you can borrow cash against your account. but those two things alone didn.t keep me there after the auto liquidate :-)

Craig





On Mar 10, 2016, at 9:37 AM, Vic Ferrari vico213@... [supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote:



Thanks Tyler and Craig ... I'm switching over from those automatons to TOS



From:��"Craig Falwell��mcfalwell@...��[supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>To:��supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com��Sent:��Thursday, March 10, 2016 10:32 AMSubject:��Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to Markets

��Not answering for Tyler- But IB has an auto liquidate function - they did this on some of my positions Aug 24th as a result of what Tyler is mentioning. Those spreads were so wide on the OTM puts that it jacks everything up and they just kill your positions (at the worst possible time of course) - I literally got a margin call notice, picked up the phone to call them, and before I finished dialing the number, my positions were gone. They say they do this to control risk, it.s all automatic and computer generated. TOS on the other hand worked with me over two days and I held on and adjusted every position I had.��



Craig

On Mar 10, 2016, at 9:19 AM, Vic Ferrari��vico213@...��[supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote:



Tyler , How do you know IB would calculate the midpoint differently than TOS ? Isn't a midpoint a midpoint ? Would every account in TOS be subjective when markets are crashing to ascertain whether midpoints are valid ? Does TOS have a method with short Calls , lets say , during a crash ,becoming way out of the money , to ��be ��disregarded in the margin requirement ? ��



From:��"Tyler Jewell��tylerjewell@...��[supertraderkarenstudy]" supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>To:��supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com��Sent:��Thursday, March 10, 2016 5:48 AMSubject:��Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to Markets

��Your required cash is the combination of the margin requirement and the cost of the option.

An option expiring in 3 days with a crazy high Vix that is deep otm will probably carry a $1000 margin requirement. �� The cost of the option is typically seem as the mid point of the spread on the bid ask.

Brokers have leniency in how they calculate the spread midpoint. �� There are many stories of brokers like ib taking completely bull shit price midpoints during crashes causing crazy cash requirements and putting you into auto liquidation. ��

Tda would not do that.

I can protect myself at ib by purchasing long calls further out but I hated spending the money.

-Tyler

---------------From: Maitrayee Vadali��mssvadali@...��[supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2016 5:43 AMSubject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to MarketsTo: supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>

��Hi,I have been following the dialogue for a few months now. I was wondering Tyler, what do you mean by IB will apply a huge requirement? Is it a fee or will they reduce your buying power? Please clarify as I am at a crossroads as to whether I should switch from IB to TD. My account size is on the smaller side. I am open to input as well. Thanks.MV---------------On Thu, 3/10/16, Tyler Jewell��tylerjewell@...��[supertraderkarenstudy] supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Subject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NO Access to MarketsTo:��supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com,��supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.comDate: Thursday, March 10, 2016, 4:39 AM

��









Yes the margin calculation would bethe same - and the margin per contract would not be thatmuch.�� However the firms also include their estimated priceper contract in addition to the margin requirement.��In the 80s when themelt down happened the systems would not have handled thewide spreads properly.�� And it is possible that immaturesystems will read an illiquid super wide spread with nochance of expiring itm as something that is worth $50 - andsuddenly bam - ib will apply a huge requirement on a bigcall position.

-Tyler---------------From:��thourat@...��[supertraderkarenstudy]supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2016 3:39 AMSubject: Re: [SuperTraderKarenStudy] TTS - NOAccess to MarketsTo:��supertraderkarenstudy@yahoogroups.com>





����



Tyler,

Why do yousay that the margin expectation is different between IB and TOS?Since therisk is thesame on any market whatever the broker, the calculation would bethe same.

Thierry



















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----------------------------

#6606 Mar 13 5:03 AM

Interactive ... do not do the Margin call thing ....I can never decide whether this is a great advantage or the opposite of being stuck with IB in Europe.



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